Unique Magic Items *

#1

The talk about Magic Items Usage inspired me a little bit:
Magic is a strange power, that can be harnessed (or not?), but never fully understood. Magic should be unique. Magic could be REALLY unique on this one world...

Say we have a fantasy world, knights, dragons, wizards and all the stuff. It is possible and common to brew potions, it is even possible to enchant weapons for short time periods with various effects. Technically it is relatively easy, even if requiring much more magical power and better material components, to create permanent magical weapons and items. But...

BUT it is impossible to create two permanent magical items of the same kind.

Magic is strange, and it seems to be not willing to be bound in the same way twice. So there is only one +1 weapon ever, only one +1 weapon with resistance to fire, etc, etc, etc.

While all possible combinations of all the possible bonuses are still a large number, this also means, that if it is simple, it was most probably done before. Want to create a +1 sword? No problem, prepare the money necessary, get the special components, the mighty wizard tries the ritual... and fails. There is a +1 sword in the world already. Same is true for all simple combinations of handy "weaker" powers. To combine more powers, and more exotical powers, you need much more resources. Some sages even speculate that once all possible combinations are created, free magic will not exist anymore.

Now think, how many magical items are in lethal dungeons, fallen in bottomless holes, never to be found again. Many are in dragon hoards, to get them you just have to ask the dragon, or kill him. Many are owned by other folk/monsters better not to mess with. Some may be lost with ancient civilisations, or be forever buried in the earthquake that happened yesterday. Some have simply fallen into the sea.

You see that many items are inaccessible for simple heroes, or mean a great deal of work and danger to get. To get exactly the kind of weapon you want, you must be very, very lucky.

Notes:
- All permanent magical items become essentially artifacts. Does not mean they are indestructible, but are VERY expensive and quite hardy. There should be also no trivial way to break their magic.
- Enchanted weapons are common, but the spells work only for hours or days. There are also spells and monsters that can break the spell, or consume its magic.
- Permanent items are rare, and show wealth and power of the user.
- Identify should be forbidden or seriously limited.
- Attempts to create an existing item may have random effects, possibly dangerous.
- Are cursed items considered different, so there CAN be two +1 swords, but one must be cursed? Can the curse be removed, and what happens afterwards? Would the curse travel to the other one, maintaining cosmic balance? Nasty option, not funny.

Well, does it put some limit on gredy players? Or maybe too much? I am not entirely sure. What do you think?

Unique Magic Items

#2

Magic Items: Public Profile

Need just to remind again that potions are certainly not permanent magic items, and are quite often created. These are the magic items even the average population can get hands on (not too often), and the bestseller healing potions have no moral stigma around them, are useful and handy.

A wand of fireballs or a +X sword is something different, it is good if in hands of heroes, but dangerous in hands of villains.

And one more thing: if a lowly peasant finds a potion, he is very likely to earn a little fortune in gold. If he finds a permanent magic item (a powerful and rare thing indeed), he is in trouble, for there are few willing to pay the right price, but many willing to take it by force.

Unique Magic Items

#3

I would also make dispell magic not work on permanate items, but still have the ability to prematurely end temporary enchantments.

This idea could also me a way to set up the differences in spiritual and arcane magic. Since arcane magic was fashioned my the will of mortal hands, it would be restriced to only one form, by artifacts, or rather relics, formed by the gods could have multiple instances, but is only present by the god's will, and if anyone should try to missuse it's power they would face the wrath of that god and likely drive it to let the relic cease to exist.

Another possible way to explain the single form of magic would be to make the permancy spell consume the casters life/spirit/essence. Since there can only ever be one person's soul with that person's point of view and memories, even identical twins wouldn't be able to form the same item since they have led seperate lives. This would cut down on the number of adventurers wanting to tinker around with making thier own artifacts and drive the price of creating them sky high. They'd best just deal with what they can find. Some people (wizard orphans) might shun artifacts in general, as they know very well that that wand of magic missiles was someone's parent/lover/sibling.

Where do items with charges fall in all this? They can only be used a limited number of times, so they aren't neccessarily permanate, but they can be recharged, so in a way, they are. Would these be permanancy spells gone wrong, or some dark and forbidden form of permanancy that consumes the soul of someone besides the caster? Or just regular items? If they ARE artifacts, shouldn't they be changed to a limited number of time a day to use them rather than charges?

Unique Magic Items

#4

I suppose it all lies in your interpretation of the idea of charges and how much stress you'd lay on the importance of uniqueness.

For example, the Staff of Saoul, crafted by the eponymous wizard, draws on the powers of an ancient deity, trapped beneath the earth in a mighty cavern. The deity is too weak to grant its powers more than once every day and only then may they be used on a quest to free the deity. After the deity is sapped of its strength it can no longer grant powers to the staff, so the staff ceases to work as a conduit: in game terms it runs out of charges.

Each staff which is created is unique and individual, so though there may only ever be one "staff of snakes" a future wizard can base his design on that of the now defunct (i.e. chargeless) staff. It will have approximately the same powers, but slightly different: e.g. it will transform into a cobra instead of a viper. When a staff runs out of charges (however that is to be interpreted) it cannot be recharged, but a new staff can be made which monopolises on the powers previously held by the dead staff.

ephe!

Unique Magic Items

#5

Magic is strange, and it seems to be not willing to be bound in the same way twice. So there is only one +1 weapon ever, only one +1 weapon with resistance to fire, etc, etc, etc.

Once this is discovered there are always easy workarounds. I am not magic master but follow this logic.

Current systems allow for the enchantment of a plus sword against a certain species. That, I would think, would be a slightly complex enchantment. Has to take into consideration all the differences between each individual and be able to recognize that, right? But an enchantment against rocks would be just as difficult because of all the different compositions of rocks. Another complex enchantment I would think. But if you could bind a sword to a single rock that you already have available, I would imagine that to be much easier to do. You have the rock, able to mystically make the sword resistant to that rock or able to easily split that rock like it was butter, some sort of enchantment to make it unique. In that case, all you need is a handful of pebbles from a stream and you have the means to uniquely enchant +1 swords with immunity to a pebble.

Using the fire analogy, you could probably enchant a + sword with immunity to wood fires, candle fires, etc., because each burn would be chemically different then the other. You could make any number of concotions and/or mixtures of stuff to make a unique fire that the sword is immune to.

Just thoughts as I get ready to work.

I am pro magic, anti limiting it if you couldn't tell. :P

Somebody has got to defend that position. :twisted:

A simple set of definitions and a list.

#6

I guess I have gamed with too many people like Strolen (or who game as Strolen presented), as I had already throught of the process to make it "player proof". All you need to do is define what is an acceptable "field" or width for a modifier trait. Any new traits proposed must be of the same width as the existing traits and should not overlap an existing trait.

Example: You would have All Fire, Mundane Fire, Magikal Fire, and Dragon Fire as the four traits in the fire category. A player could propose a new fire trait. To be accepted it would have to be a type of fire not defined as above and be of the same width (atomic fire maybe?). So Candle Fire is a subgroup of Mundane fire, so it would be too narrow in definition. Chemical Fire has too much overlap with mundane fire. Pyros instead of fire would be disallowed because it is the overlap with all fire, being a synonym.

You would also have the category of weapon, sword, axe/mace, pole weapon, flexible weapon, and missle weapon. I would not do it that way. I would define it as Weapons, Earth Weapons (those of metal or stone), Wood Weapons (those of mostly wood). So three weapons of a given type would be possible that way. Note: You might have a Fire Weapon being invented when Black Powder weapons come of age. Water Weapons occuring in the age of blasters (fusion, don't you know).

Mixing and matching additional abilities would increase that 3, but it does put a dent in what is possible.

For ease of use you would create a list of common fields, which would help you define what is and is not generally possible. It would be used as an example for those that get "creative" in their enchantment.

In fact, I am sure there is a near immortal member of the mages guild that is the keeper of the book, that which they list what is and is not available to be used. His would be a sad job as he would be cataloging the demise of magik. (As traits are bound, then the items lost no longer available to be used... that magik is lost forever).

Heck if Corvus was in this world, it would be impossible to make an orb, as he would of created an orb of every trait. In fact, certain types of items, some of them quite common, would be lost to modern time because of the lost enchantments of previous times.

Unique Magic Items

#7

The plan was to give something for both Strolen and MoonHunter :twisted: :wink:

- if you want a permanent magical item, you cannot simply ask for a nice +1 sword, you must think carefully and choose smartly something that is not likely to made ever before. Smart thinking was therefore expected.

- of course, candle fire would not be accepted. Nice try, Strolen! :wink:

- if someone comes up with a new trait, or actually a new category, it will be a much discussed news between all magic-users. Why was it not tried before? If it was, why didn't it work then, but does now? Can new traits or entire categories come into existence? How is it possible?

- hmm... elemental kind of weapons... interesting. Rhymes with elemental categories, and makes the entire world more focused on elements, and/or other uebermensch categories. Interesting world specificator.

Unique Magic Items

#8

Agar:

I would also make dispell magic not work on permanate items, but still have the ability to prematurely end temporary enchantments.

Right.

Spiritual/Arcane magic are of course different and permanency may be much easier. But the thing is, gods would never make the same thing twice anyway... even if they could. And maybe they can, but that's not your problem, mortal! :wink:

Consuming life/spirit/essence... I have seen that somewhere. Let's say the first artifact costs 10hp, second 20hp, third 40hp, fourth 80hp... see where it is going? The loss is irreversible, and weakens for the same number of weeks - is it worth to recover for months?

Consuming the soul, or part of it, ohhh... not nice. I was thinking this world would be permanency-hostile enough!

Will think about charging items later.

Unique Magic Items

#9

I guess I have gamed with too many people like Strolen (or who game as Strolen presented)

Hey, somebodies got to fight the fight otherwise we are all just agreeing. Drives out more ideas in many cases as well.

The ideas presented are good and I like them mucho.

How about if there was a way that another powerful wizard, through a most ancient or perhaps very new type of magic, found a way to *steal* the magic from others weapons and imbue it into their own. Basically tranferring the magic from one weapon to another. Mr. Evil could figure out this special technique and start collecting the magic of the world for his own. That would be a cool plot for a game :wink: :twisted:

Re: Unique Magic Items

#10

One way:

- Are cursed items considered different, so there CAN be two +1 swords, but one must be cursed? Can the curse be removed, and what happens afterwards? Would the curse travel to the other one, maintaining cosmic balance? Nasty option, not funny.

Say it is so, you create a new cursed item, as a copy of an existing one, and remove the curse... getting a fine weapon for cheap (or not? :? ), and knowing some poor wannabee hero has now a cursed dingus at hand. How Evil feels sometimes so good... :twisted:

Unique Magic Items

#11

A way I thought about limiting magic was that magic was exhausting and hideously unpredictable. And I make a distinction between real magic and alchemy (which is basically primitive chemistry). So, if you want a basic potion, like maybe a healing potion, you go see an alchemist or an apothecary. Something more... exotic, like a magical weapon or artifact, or even a potion of flight or some such thing, you go see a MU, be prepared to wait a good long while, pay a large fee, and MAYBE get what you want. Or maybe blow something up. Given a choice like that, a lot of people will make do with non-magical items, and MUs are highly valued (most of the time.)

Unique Magic Items

#12

I don't really understand why you must call for a limit to magic all the time. I'm not naming any names (Cough,cough, Agar, cough, Manfred) but a few of you seem particularly anti-magic. I realize the need to make magic more "magical." In D&D, it is treated pretty much just like technology and tools, as it is in most games. That's just wrong, man, wrong. It needs to have some sort of mysticism about it. But why limit it so much?

The speed limit is....

#13

Any source of power needs some kind of limits or breaks upon it, even technology. If there are no or few limits upon a source of "power", then there is no way for the GM to create tension or drama in the game. Think about how often the Star Trek Transporter went out or broke or was otherwise unavailable. If it didn't break so often, so many interesting episodes would of just been boring as the transporter magikally solve the problem. "The Orc Horde comes towards you. The Dust rises, the Stench is..... Players: "Sigh. We Dimension Portal out of the way. We throw the chain lightingbolts from the wands through the portal before it closes, just for fun. We portal back into where the leader was, where the paladin will protect us from Evil and his shield will protect us from all missile attacks. Arnie will then fireball with his staff the Evil Orc Lord until properly toastie." Three rounds later, the GM states, "Well that was an exciting."

The magik/ technology that makes life/ adventures so easy tends to make it so there is no adventure in life.

Magik will sometimes replace characters. After all, why do you really need a theif for sneaking about, when you can get a cloak of invisability and boots of Elvenkind/ quiet sneaking? If you were the thief in the party, other than finding traps, what good would you be when the fighter with the magik items takes your nitch AND can kick sword butt. (Now these items are perfectly fine, but I personally would not let them into my world very easiliy if I had a thief in the party).

There is the ever present Arms Race that occurs. If you have X amount of mystic might, you really can only be threatened by someone with X or X+1 amount. Your troupe generated items so they can take on the next great threat. Now the next great threat must be that much better. Eventually the players get more power to defeat one of the next great threats, and now the NGTs must be bigger/ badder/ more X+1. It just gets bad if magik is how you generate X. If you apply diversity to the type of dramatic conflict (Well yes you have a +20 sword, but you can't use it on the Evil Cardnal without being excommunicated and the king having to eject you from court and possibly exile you from the country...) Certain elements of magik make other scenarios easily defeatable (fine we put the item of truthfullness (it was actually a curse on a belt of strength) in everyones hand and ask them if they did it)

Now this issue is not restricted to magik. The same thing can be said for technology (more annoying because you just can't say "no") or super powers. A clever player with some technology skills can make things that will make any scenario a cake walk (You created an EMP Bomb?.. You created a laser refractor. ... You created a 3D disguise imager?. You McGuyvered What?). A technologist with some parts and a little time is vastly more unbalancing to a game situation than any magik user. Add replicators, nano technology, and other sci-fi elements and it all goes south. Super Powers are the same things, except the GM just has to be careful when allowing them in. Screaning them for all their potential uses (A simple low level power with a great special effect can be devestating, as it is flexible and can be leveraged into many events).

So as long as there are some limits, there is some drama, and some drama makes for a better game.

Unique Magic Items

#14

So why not give them weaker magic instead of less magic?

okay

#15

Either technique will work. You just have to be careful with plentiful weak magik.

There is an old saying (or some variation upon) found in many books in the occult section of your bookstore: There are two ways to divert the course of a mighty river. The first is to dump tons of rocks in the deep banks. The second is to put a rock in the slow trickle at the source, changing that flow. The meaning... if you work it right, a little effort in the right place can have a greater effect than a huge effort in another place.

I take bit of sorcerous wisdom to heart. There was a pixie in a campaign I know of. This little pixie had unlimited cantrips... tiny magiks. It appeared to be a nothing when compared to the mighty heroes of the campaign, so the GM let it in. Fool.

The story revolves around an enemy army coming to take the capitol. You see the mighty characters could not risk fighting an entire army. They would, eventually, die, and enough of the opposing force would complete their mission. They knew that for sure because said army had nearly kicked their butt last time. This tiny creature did what the big party of adventurers could not do, bring an enemy army to its knees. How? With the simple and well timed application of tiny cantrips (sneeze and push to get people in fires, snuff to make people go restart fires, spoil and a few other ones to destroy their supplies, a few bits of ventriquism and they were attacking themselves in the dark). Within the day, they were returning back home with their tail between their leg.

So tiny magiks can have big effects if you think about what you are doing. The morals of the story? Never underestimate any character. Never underestimate the power of any magik (or technology or skill).

So weaker magik can solve part of the problems I mentioned in my previous post. It delays the arms race, scaling it down to a manageble level. It can make things more manageable for a time. However, lots of little powers can add up to a LOT of trouble down the line.

That is why we tirade about this. Because we have seen it happen and know the results upon a campaign. That is why I play with and advocate for smaller amounts and weaker magik, as I try to make the characters important, rather than their equipment. (as well as avoid hassles down the line with trying to design new challanges and the arms race).

Note: GM TIP: When considering a character for a campaign, consider the character AND the player playing it. A character which might be appropriate for one player to play, would become a campaign destroying thing in the hands and playstyle of another player in your group.

Unique Magic Items

#16

I will theorise for a moment freely, to see what happens. A whole night of thinking brought many ideas, I hope I can paste them together...

About magic and permanency:

So why exactly can't you have ten +1 swords, and the enchanted ones don't last long?

If I think about magic, I imagine waves: large invisible waves permeating everything, the whole world. Disturbances included. The waves of magic are akin to real waves, they may be slow, but with enough time they can level mountains and continents. And so do the waves erode concentrated magic. To hold against this neverstopping and random pressure, one has to use special formulas, and they better be not too complicated(6). So simple potions of healing are useful for weeks, even months, more complex potions may last good for days. Weapons you enchant are 'magical' for hours only. Basically, the more complicated ANY spell is, the shorter its duration. Magical portals would stay open for minutes or seconds only.

Alright, but how to make something permanent? If something is tightly anchored to same spot, it won't last against the sea. Now that everything is about waves and vibrations, why not something a vibration of its own? (1) Sounds weird, keep it.

Now to the problem of how to insert this uniqueness into play. Hmmm... One option:
In the process of creation of a permanent item, which uses up LOTS of magic, great waves of magical energy flow over the whole world (maybe too weird, but got no other idea at the moment). (2) What happens, if a given 'vibration' (a wave with a certain wavelength) meets the same kind of vibration? Let's suppose a resonance happens, the wave multiplies in power (3), and hits even back on the yet unfinished item. The result is obviously item destruction and random magical effects. (4) , (5)

About the sources of uniqueness:

1. The basic elements of Nature are unique in themselves. Simply reduce the weapon to 'its' element (metal to Earth etc.) and mix to the result with desired effects (+1 sword 8) ). If it is new, it will work. (7)

2. Elements are nice, but have their limits. Besides the numerical limit, they can only have certain non-stop powers (protects against this, +X to fight). You get nothing more. So the other source of uniqueness is... a soul.

It is true, no two are the same. Every soul has a unique 'vibration' of its own. If you connect a part of it to an item, it can become permanent. What's more, it gains some of the abilities you have! As for the price, with a certain duality thought I have in mind, hm hm hmmm... it will be exactly half of your soul. Sounds weird, will keep it. Logically, you can't make more than one such item, unless you want to die immediatelly, or worse. So the item takes on a part of your powers (you must choose which ones to what part), and grows stronger as you do. Hmm... many possibilities. Say that as long as you hold it, you are a complete being, in fact something stronger because of the additional powers enspelled in the item. But if you loose it... oops. Note: The elemental items give no special power/bonus/resistance against races or monsters, but if you hate someone particularly, this kind of item may well do.

Will think about more options later, what happens in your afterlife, and other neat stuff. For now, let it be clear, that charged items can exist, and their magic comes from the same magic-gathering process wizards use. No wonder, 'cause there is a part of a wizard inside :twisted:

One last thing: sure the wizards do the magic, but any person can have such an item made, so thieving implements, big warrior swords, all can be done. It's just all these items have a slightly more personal touch now.

Notes:

(1) What happens, if you manage to create something with exactly the same 'vibration', as the surrounding magic? Maybe... nothing. Maybe... plot hook.

(2) May have ugly consequences on temporary items and spells nearby.

(3) Well, I know this might be completely wrong from a physic's point of view, but hey, this is fantasy physics. Don't worry, it will get only worse.

(4) Special circumstances might disrupt this wave-thingy and cause the item to survive. So there might be two (or more!) items of the same kind. I want them all unique, so will ignore this option. Those of you that don't, keep in mind the chance of disaster grows, and it will be MUCH worse when it comes.

(5) Random magical effects are likely to happen around the original item too. Possibly a way to wreak havoc anywhere on the entire world, where a special item is. Hmmm, will keep this for villains...

(6) Remember reading a long time ago about alchemists and astronomers of old. Symbols that are in some way perfect and unique... now what does this remind me of. I think it was Johannes Kepler that had this minor obsession with perfect polyhedral shapes (that means geometry, you pervert!). The cube is one. This may form very a strange base for the magic, based on math and perfection, see here for more. Cool and weird, but better OPTIONAL.

(7) Optional: allow for an unlimited number of items based on elements, for a more classical fantasy, with heaps of +1 swords.

(99) Hear the Beach Boys and their 'Good Vibrations!

Unique Magic Items

#17

I am not really for restricting magic, but I do like to work off ideas and suggest possible new directions. Normally when I gm, I tend to get a bit Monty Haul, 'cause, well, magic stuff is coooool! 8)

While having rare or unpredictable magic items is an interesting challenge, if the players are having to work hella hard to use their items, they will jsut using them. Star Trek has technichians (they should fire) to maintain thier transporter, but the thing keeps going squirrely. If a fighter has a +1 sword that only gives that plus one if he does an exhausting practice routine in the morning, he's liable to ditch the magic sword and just use an old fashioned chunk of steel. Rather than being wore out and need to rest a couple hours before he gets started just in case he needs that plus one, he could just strap on a blade and ride off without having to deal with all the issues.

This style of play can be fun if worked correctly. As long as everyone is level across the board, PC's and NPC's alike, the various styles can be alot of fun and really bring new life into a game you might have been tiring of. Low Magic or NO Magic worlds can really let players explore new types of characters while High Magic can let them play with the toys they've been itching to mess with. Just don't skimp on what the NPC's get. Anything the players get to have, the NPC's have access to as well.

Unique Magic Items

#18

I think magical items should be very rare,and low magic/no magic worlds are much more intresting.I and my 1st ex made a world where there was only one living mage and he lived on an island.In four stories only one magical item ever turned up.

Unique Magic Items

#19

I always do this. For playtesting, I found the biggest munchkin I could, and ran him through the system. He has an uncanny knack of finding loopholes in even the most clever game system, and exploiting them to the fullest: infinite attribute points in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Other Strangeness, automatic no-roll one-round kills in d20, etc.

I am also a big proponent of many little magics. Not only does it stop the 'bigger badder" syndrome, but it requires that both players and GM think more, rather than rely upon some large spell effect or monster.

I would think that with magic in this proposed setting having such a limitation, then nearly every mage would try and compile charts of magic items/effects. It could go to either extreme, either mages cooperate to keep their charts as up-to-date as possible, or that anyone discovering a new crafting would keep it a secret as much as possible.