Strolen's Citadel

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Link Farm, the Hell you say?

Started by Strolen Feb 16, 2005 13 posts Locked

  1. Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #1
    Ok, I don't want a link farm but I want something easier to navigate through than our awesome link thread. It has a ton of goodies in ther but they are damn hard to find. Whenever I am bored at work but don't have time to do anything I jump in there randomly and find something interesting to do.

    The top 100 crap that the rpggateway is spitting out isn't the greatest either and the link structure they have is pretty disorganized and I get annoyed trying to browse it. Google still rocks but I just want.....

    I want something unique but still useful, find what you are looking for but don't get lost. It basically boils down to a sweet category system that is intuitive but not overwhelming. Nothing new with that, we have been dealing with that the entire time with the rebuild and is the key to a good link listing.

    Just an idle idea at the moment and don't know the specifics of implementation but here it is anyways...

    Was thinking of using a points based system to assign sites to categories. Basically there are a lot of sites that cannot be pigeon holed into one or two categories.

    So each site would have so many points to spend on giving it placement in categories. The more points in each category the higher it would be in the listings.

    That is about as far as I got. The details buried me and I don't want to spend too much time on it when I have so much else to do, but the idea continues to nag.

  2. Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #2
    And the (arguably) better sites would have more points to distribute?

    So simpler, one-purpose sites can rank higher in their respective categories, while the all-rounders can get good placing in a few places, and lower in others.

    Sounds like yet another system to tweak and toy with, and maybe allow people to vote on.

    It only gets bigger, this page. :)

  3. Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #3
    Just a thought:

    We could make it a different category, like Item/ Location/ et al, but we don't put it on the main page, just the side bar menu (I mean geeze how many categories do we need if we add Dungeon and everything that strikes our fancy)

    The Links page would be formatted just like a "type" page to keep things simple. That way you can get a random link by simply refreshing the page. You can get highly ranked ones from the Hall of Heroes. You can get the last one entered. The page entries can be categoriezed, so you can search for what sort of thing you are looking for.

    Each Entry would be much like one of my full entries. Link plus a description... a big description... usually pulled from the page's FAQ.

    We will need to patrol this to prevent people from spamming it.


    Originally, I was thinking of making them "article" scroll; with a header explaining them and linking them all together. But we can take this to several levels higher, if you want to invest the time. We have the data, with only a minimum of editing it will usful in such a format.

    Thoughts?

  4. Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #4
    Trying to figure out an ordering system to reward the excellent sites in each category. Had a whole list of ideas then realized that Moon was right, again, and having votes and comments on each site just like any other would work just as fine as any other.

    I don't think there will be as much action on them but as long as a few people honestly vote on them that will be enough for a decent sort order.

    Comments could be useful, but not necessary. I should make dummy account, or at least something to add the sites without putting our name to it, unless you want that ability. We could give the submitter of the site XP for the submission and then the XP associated with the votes. Might get people submitting quality sites or might get spammers that don't care about XP but we can take care of that.

    Current system might just work just fine.

    There can have a link to a form for the sites webmaster to send us a comment about how we handle their site or to change the description to what they request. If they register we should allow them to take ownership of the submission (getting XP and such) if they so desire as well.

  5. Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #5
    Had another thought this morning:

    The problem with many link sites, as I see it, is that they must be pigeonholed into one or two categories. Many sites, this one for instance, serve many different purposes. Some better than others but they are different resources none-the-less.

    So to allow sites that are not specialized to get face time for what they offer, well, they can't. If you are looking for a forum roleplaying game you won't find my site under that because it is a small part of the overall site. But when you find me under resource or something and you realize I have a game like that, but you find it quite on accident.

    So why can't we find a way to highlight all the different things that a site does? The specialized sites will obviously get a higher billing, but what is wrong with my link being at the very bottom of a play by forum list?

    I have a vision, a dream if you will...

    We have site links, and instead of voting on the site as a whole (although that may be part of it) we instead vote on how well it fits in a certain category.

    These votes would then measure each site in each category as far as the listings go and list them appropriately.

    So I put in Strolen's Citadel in the links with a nice description. In order for it to show up in a category I now need to vote on it. A scale of 1-5 or maybe 1-10 to vote on how appropriate it is for a certain category. So Maybe I would get high votes in Resource or Items, NPCs, plots, whatever but a low vote in Play by forum. The more people that rate it as a good resource in that category, the higher the rankings in that category.

    Obviously we can’t just have anybody voting so have to figure that out. Maybe the admins/mods are the only ones that can rate the sites for the categories or something? Limit the number of votes they have so they can only vote for, say, 5 categories or something. Or limit it as points like mentioned before, they have 20 points to distribute in any number of categories with the max being 10 points in any one category. So depending on how many points they put in a category will determine how close to the top they are in that section.

    Also their can’t be an insane number of categories unless there is an easy way to lump them together where they don’t overlap so you don’t have to hunt all over for categories to put yourself in. Not sure how that would work either.

    This is concept, brainstorming, don't be too critical there is an idea in there somewhere.

  6. Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #6
    Obviously we can’t just have anybody voting so have to figure that out. Maybe the admins/mods are the only ones that can rate the sites for the categories or something? Limit the number of votes they have so they can only vote for, say, 5 categories or something. Or limit it as points like mentioned before, they have 20 points to distribute in any number of categories with the max being 10 points in any one category. So depending on how many points they put in a category will determine how close to the top they are in that section.


    So... more points = better page, right?

    With all my dislike for the level system, it could have use here: simply base the number of points on the submitter's level. That way it couldn't happen that someone comes by, registers only to post a link to own page, and vote it into heavens. (I leave the exact details and numbers to you...)

    And truth to be told, if only the admins/mods would do that, there would be too few votes I am afraid... we have too little time to search the myriads of pages in the link thread, even less for all the others outside in the depths of Internet.

    So let's give the option to everyone, and more of a vote to the experienced users.


    Now we only need the categories. *starts casting a Summon MoonHunter spell*

  7. Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #7
    You are right, of course. Didn't think about the level thing really but that got me thinking a little. Not sure I will use it though.

    I have sort of a hierarchy deal in mind which is an obvious starting point for a link list.

    rough categories made up on the spot

    Fantasy
    Horror/Gothic
    SF
    Historical
    Modern/Espionage
    Super Heroes

    Then the next level that would be the same under each. Something like:

    System Specific
    Forums/Community
    IRC/Chat
    Worlds/Settings
    Reference
    Links
    Resources
    Stories/Campaign Notes

    Under those again would be the last level, which would really sort of be two levels if you ignore the major seperation at the top which isn't that deep but gives enough to actually organize constructively.

    Take Resources as the example assuming each of the others would have their own stuff unique lists.

    Items
    Plots/Scenerios
    Characters/NPCs
    Maps
    Creatures
    Galleries

    Had a thought that each link would be given an amount of points equal to the amount of categories at that level to divy up as the webmaster, or responsible submitter, decided.

    So the main cats would have 6 points. They could put 1 in each category and show up in each but would be ranked very low or they could put all in one category and max it out.

    -6 in Fantasy.

    The next set would be 8. Now they have to start making decisions on how they want to rank in each of these categories.

    -2 Forums/Community
    -2 Worlds/Settings
    -2 Resources

    The last set they get 6 points to divy up between them.

    -2 Items
    -1 Plots/Scenerios
    -2 Characters/NPCs
    -1 Creatures

    So now we have a somewhat relative and useful ranking system with that. The one main problem I see is that the sites that specialize are going to get the highest rankings...but is that so bad?

    Perhaps it can be cumulative?

    I have 6 in Fantasy, that would be the only number for the top level sort.

    I have 2 in Fantasy->Resources. That would be 8 total from the two levels. So my straight fantasy resource site would rate higher than a SF/Fantasy resource site. That seems to make sense if you are under Fantasy looking for a resource, the straight fantasy site should rate higher then a mix...perhaps. All depends on the quality of the site but lets just leave that be for a moment.

    Then I put 2 in Fantasy->Resources->Items which puts that cat total at 10. Now, another site that specializes in Items and has been the same as me now would put a higher number in Items, perhaps even a 6 making their total 14 which would put them near the top of that category. Somebody that has a fantasy site that only has items might even have a 20 in this site since it is the only category they fit in.

    So each site gets to categorize itself and tailor the points to what the site offers. Those sites that are dispersed still sort of get the shaft though and that is the problem I run into.

    Then perhaps the voting system can come into play where you don't necessarily vote for a site as a whole, but vote for a site in a category. After all, a site that absolutely has some kick ass items but completely sucks in all other aspects might get an overall crappy vote which, when it comes to items, is totally undeserved. They might have a 5 flame in items and a 2 flame in stories (or whatever). But that solution entails a lot of voting in each category and that seems a bit labor intensive. But then, all it takes is one person with honest voting (which is pretty much the key and what we would be depending on) to correctly identify it. Sorting in each category could obviously be by points or votes.

    Starting to ramble a bit so will stop for now.

  8. okay... you are making it so hard

    #8
    Really. Links should be a Scroll. An Article Scroll. There is such diversity in our Gamer Interesting Posts, that new categories could be painful. We can then post comments and votes on the links.

    If you want, make the Links part of the main directory bar (what do we call that piece of real estate) or something on the side. But either way, it takes you to the scoll.

  9. Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #9
    I am trying to make it convenient to actually find something we are looking for. I don't want to use any of the current systems because, for links, you still wouldn't find anything.

    Even if you put them into an Article Scroll or something, would you just lump them all in there? Seperate them into a couple Scrolls? Still a problem with separating them and finding anything.

    Links are very valuable, when you can find the ones you are looking for. If they are just a huge list, or pages and pages of lists of links, then I am better off just using google.

  10. Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #10
    In most cases, the title of the post, lists what sort of topics the site(s) cover. If it doesn't we could make it so.

    Will the magic index software work for version 2.0? We could just have the new "First Page" be an alpha index, or I could work out the IGW List ( http://www.rpgcitadel.com/guild/index.php?topic=1521.0 )

    You could just search the section or thread (does the new search allow you to search just one thread or category?)

    And Articles categories will cover just about everything well, except cnn and the art sites. That is why I wanted Replies to be full entries and automatically attached to the King Post. They all sort under the King Post and will have their own categories.

  11. Re: Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #11
    Dug this up from the catacombs as I am actively working on it (well, sort of. Got the bug during insomnia and got a few more things done on it.)

    http://www.strolen.com/links.php

    I got it sort of working with the numbers adding up and such. The one problem I ran into was that everything has to be an OR statement till I figure a way around it. So if you pick two categories then everything with those two cats in them will show up, even if they both aren't in the same submission. Those submissions with them both should pop towards the top, but that all depends on how many points they allocated to those cats. So I have to figure out how to force the AND if that is what people want to search for.

    Then intention is to get them a lot like the current site. Codices, scrolls, comments, and votes and all that. Link counters too for how often that site is visited. It is at the very beginnings so I removed all that stuff that isn't being used and will readd it as I continue.

    The titled link will take you to the citadel page for that site, the url texted link will take you directly to the actual site.

  12. Re: Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #12
    If you can give the main site multiple free text options, you could then use that mechanic as the sort feature... The "free-text" would then be inserted when choosing the site's elements.

  13. Re: Link Farm, the Hell you say?

    #13
    From the new freetext system to this... I am impressed Strolen. I really am!

    Well done!

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